Queer and Queerer Ep. 20 – The History of Queer Podcasting or How to Abuse Peterson on a Podcast

Joe "not-so" Cool

Zack and Peterson are back together this week! And while Peterson is interested in conducting a sensible interview with our guest, Joe Gee, about being one of the earliest queer podcasters, Joe and Zack are more interested in spending the show busting on Peterson. Still, we manage to discuss Joe’s experiences podcasting, we “bump” a whole bunch of other shows, and Joe also talks about walking away from Quakerism and becoming a non-believer and humanist. Enjoy this raucous half-hour with your favorite queer podcasters back in action with puns and euphemisms galore!

The Queer and Queerer Podcast!

Listen to this week’s episode

// Here’s some more information about what we talked about this week:

» Teresa Ortega’s blog – In Sequence

» Yeast Radio featuring Madge Weinstein

» Queer Podder (now qpodder)

» The Progrum with Wanda Wisdom

» Ragan Fox’s Podcast (Fox and the City) and Blog (America’s Next Top Bottom)

» The Flatus Show with Kentie

» Hot Fossils and Rebel Matters with Ninja

» Zillafag

» Watch the Holy Ghost Enema video on YouTube!!

» Adam Curry (Podshow, by the way, is now Vimeo)

» Music Alley (formerly PodSafe)

» The Dark Forest (not Deep Forest) with Ranger John

» The Lesbian Mafia

» Feast of Fun

» Same Sex Sunday

Queer and Queerer Episode 18 The Queers are All Right

Peterson and Zack come out to the movies! Get it? Come out? Today they discuss the new film “The Kids Are All Right,” starring Annette Bening and Julianne Moore as a lesbian couple whose kids make contact with their interloping sperm donor. “Outraged” is also on topic as the Queer and Queerer duo reflect back on discussions about political outing now that they’ve seen the film. Below, in the notes are suggestions from friends and listeners about all kinds of amazing queer films to check out! Never underestimate the power of film.

For our 20th episode, we want you to ask us ANY questions you have. Start submitting them now on Twitter or at zackfordblogs@gmail.com. We’ll remind you again next week.

The Queer and Queerer Podcast!

click here to listen to this week’s podcast

Here’s some more information about what we talked about this week:

Filmmaker Tom Murray who passed away last week. We will miss you!

The Lesbian Mafia interview with Kirby Dick, director of Outraged

The Lesbian Mafia Review of The Kids Are All Right

Dan Savage “The Stranger” Podcast discussing lesbians who “go straight”

Steve Hayes The Tired Old Queen at the Movies The Celluloid Closet Peterson queried people via Facebook and Twitter:

For LGBTIQ folks & Allies: What film(s) has been helpful to you in coming out/becoming an ally.

Here are some responses:

From Twitter:

lilithvf1998 … Um, almost every film with a supposed trans character in it has made me reconsider coming out. Dare I list them all? Rocky Horror? The Crying Game? Silence Of The Lambs? Ticked-Off Tr*nn**s With Knives? There has yet to be a film positive enough
mayanorange A Single Man is a really beautiful love story that rings true… it transcends genders involved, doesn’t bow to stereotypes, etc…
SabrinaGeek would love to find films to show her mom. Best she found so far is Transamerica
lilithvf1998 replies: I can’t even endorse that one FWIW. The closest I can manage is The World According To Garp–and not even then really.
SabrinaGeek I especially need to avoid docs that show cases of violence / abuse/ death as they will trigger my mom- almost non-existant!
JTWilliamson I really enjoyed the movie Latter Days

From Facebook

Chloë, Jude & Oshee: Ma Vie En Rose–Belgian film about a family’s struggle to accept their child’s gender.
Immanuel : I don’t know if it counts, but there was a tv serial in Sweden called Dårfinkar & dönickar when I was a kid. It’s about Simon/Simone, a “girl” who is “mistaken” for a boy when “she” moves to a new school. Simon and Brandon Teena in Boys Don’t Cry were the only FTM role models available for many years. It’s depressing to think of Brandon Teena’s fate, so I’ve identified a lot with effeminate guys instead, like Billy Elliot. Not MTF characters, but male-identified sissies.
Karen : You know, my mind went back over a lot of great movies (“Latter Days” is a favorite.) But when I tried to think about when I was first becoming an ally, back in the wayback, what popped into my mind was Billy Crystal’s portrayal of a gay …man in the TV show Soap. It was so moving and sympathetic. I hadn’t realized it until now, but looking back, I know that made an impact. About that same time was a made-for-TV movie called That Certain Summer, about a boy whose dad was coming out as gay. I think that probably affected my outlook too. A movie I saw recently that might be helpful is called Inlaws and Outlaws.
Jude : Before Night Falls
Michael : The Wizard of Oz, Making Love, In and Out.
Deric : Raspberry Reich. A little artsy, but hearing Marcuse being quoted while two cute guys got it on was particularly stirring for this radical queer.
Micah : But I’m a Cheerleader, Saved, and Fish Can’t Fly (not just sucking up, I swear! 🙂 )
John : Paris is Burning.
Roger : A made for TV movie that is now out on DVD Doing Time on Maple Drive with a great cast too.
David : Maurice (1986). Bloody brilliant film based on the novel by EM Forster, inspired by his own experience as a closeted gay man in Edwardian England. It was written around the time of WWI, but was never published until after his death, in the …1970s. The film gave me the courage to come out. The filmmakers were Ismael Merchant and James Ivory (A Room with a View, Howard’s End etc), who were real-life romantic partners. Ismael sadly died in 2005.
Steve : Steve Flower Making Love, Torch Song Trilogy, An Early Frost (first AIDS movie I remembered). Broken Hearts Club, an indie film titled Shelter, Latter Days (a big one, for anyone with a religious background), Beautiful Thing, Edge of Seventeen. I was a junkie for teen coming out movies, even though I was 48 when I started to come out
Kellie : TV rather than film but I have a huge diary entry from when I was a teenager watching ‘My So Called Life‘ and it had a massive impact on making me question the official Christian line on being gay. I loved Ricky so much I couldn’t accept the idea that God wouldn’t love him too :O) That’s when I first became an ally, aged 14.
Shirley : Kellie I also loved Ricky. That episode about him and the drama teacher! What a wonderful wee actor. Wonder what he’s doing now.
Oshee : More of my favorites: Canadian movie about a professor at a Christian college falling in love with another woman]; Different For Girls (British movie about a Trans Woman); Normal (American movie about a Trans Woman coming out later in life); Better Than Chocolate (Canadian movie with a whole cast of LGBT characters)
Tom : The scene in Cabaret when Brian (Michael York), as the Baron lights his cigarette and they hold on to that gesture and touch for just a split second longer than would others — and I just knew what that was “code’ for. Recently saw C.R.A.Z.Y., and while not exactly my experience, much of it was pretty close and there were enough similarities that it brought back some bittersweet and difficult memories. Not to mention that could have been my wardrobe the main character wears as he comes of age. Scary!
Fran : ‎For the Bible Tells Me So— documentary interviewing young gays and lesbians and their families, talking about how they have dealt with their sexuality. Really wonderful discussions about the Bible and gays– and some heart wrenching stories as well. Highly recommended, and a great place to start a discussion with a mixed group.
Katie : Orlando, and Wonder Boys
Melanie : I loved Antonia’s Line, a beautiful Dutch film about a matriarch and her family, including a lesbian daughter.
Casey : Fish Can’t Fly
Carlos : As trite or antiquated as it may sound, Boys in the Band. Oh, and Get Real.
Jake : Later Days
Oliver : Chutney Popcorn (great lesbian film)
Angela : Claire of the Moon, Go Fish, and Incredibly True Adventures of Two Girls in Love (more great lesbian films)
Oshee : Some more : Desert Hearts and Female Perversions” starring the fabulous Tilda Swinton
Twister : Show Me Love (Fucking Åmål)
Sadelle : Pouquoi pas moi
Jenessa : Imagine Me and You and Fire

Queer and Queerer Ep. 17 – The Summer Destruction of Marriage Tour

Peterson and Zack are back together in the Sunbury studio! After some reflections on their conference experiences, they delve into the antics of the National Organization for Marriage (NOM) and their “Summer Marriage Tour.” How do we respond to their self-victimizing tactics and what is the future of the marriage equality movement? Petersonalso shares his experience confronting a bride-to-be and her maid of honor that chose a gay club for their bachelorette outing. Join them as they rip apart the very fabric of traditional marriage.

The Queer and Queerer Podcast!

Listen to this week’s episode:

// click here to listen!

Download Right-click and save as to download.

Here’s some more information about what we talked about this week:

» Freedom To Marry

» NOM’s Self-victimizing fake news story.

» “The Solution to Gay Marriage” as seen in Indianpolis.

» Join Equality Pennsylvania and the LGBT Community Center for the Harrisburg response to NOM.

» Town Danceboutique in Washington, DC

Queer and Queerer Ep. 15 – Hottest Queer Destination? Fort Worth, Hell, or Other _____?

Zack and Peterson come to you with travel advice! First up: An in-depth analysis of the reactions from church groups to pro-LGBT policies in Ft. Worth, TX. Where are they coming from and how should we feel about their complaints? Then, it’s the listeners’ turn to chime in! See where Queer and Queerer listeners think are the best places to be gay, lesbian, trans, and/or queer. As episode 15 rolls on past, we still leave you with the lingering question of who is queer and who is queerer?

The Queer and Queerer Podcast!

Listen to this week’s episode HERE

// Here’s some more information about what we talked about this week:

Quotes from the Facebook friends about best LGBTQ places to live and visit:

Michael Trey says:

As a previous lesbian and a current trans man, I have really only lived one place – Tampa Bay – I have survived as both! I haven’t traveled since transition except to Disney for a weekend and as a trans man it was the most comfortable experience I have ever had in regard to bathrooms. Sounds weird but being around so many other cultures, confident in my own identity for once – I realized that the US is much more concerned with bathrooms and who uses them, than the rest of the world!

Sarah says:

I guess for me it has more to do with the sense of community and less with queer-kindness of a place. Ability to walk down the street holding another woman’s hand without turning heads means less if I don’t feel like I can authentically connect … See Morewith the community. I certainly want both, but for “best” places to live, it has to be the place where I can be real without hesitation and be deeply known.

» Coverage related to Ft. Worth LGBT policies:

» News report from last night’s Town Council meeting.

» Minutes and video from last night’s meeting. (Comments start at1:55:30)

» TransForm New Hampshire

» Netroots Nation

Zack is going to Netroots Nation, so he fulfills his promise to do the podcast naked! To help set the mood, Peterson reads some erotic poems. The conversation evolves into an exploration of queer culture over time and throughout different regions. How do we all move forward when some are living in the closet while others are eager to reject the norms of society? In what ways does sexual liberation overlap with queer rights and what can we glean from Zack Rosen’s decision to use his body to get votes? Tune in and then leave a comment to join today’s sexy discussion.

The Queer and Queerer Podcast Episode 14

Audre Lorde

// Here’s some more information about what we talked about this week:

» Zack’s post about Zack Rosen offering to strip for votes. (Lots of discussion here!)

» C.P. Cavafy Homepage

» Audre Lorde and the Erotic

» “Sweet Voices” by C. P. Cavafy

» TransForm New Hampshire

And if you want to see a photo of my cock, given to you free of charge without exchange for votes, click here.

Shame and Loathing

This week in my memoir writing I have focused on events that took place at the Love in Action ex-gay residential facility. Back in 2003 I could not speak directly about a lot of what happened there, even with friends. Instead I wrote a one-person comedy, Doin’ Time in the Homo No Mo Halfway House–How I Survived the Ex-Gay Movement! In this farce I gave the audience a tour of the facility which attempted to straighten out gays. I highlighted the zaniness of the place, and then added some poignant touches. To accomplish this, I had to do it all in character using other voices, other personalities. It was too hot to touch directly. Indirectly I exposed the foolishness and the awfulness of the place and the process to de-homosexualize oneself.

Time passed and by 2008 I felt I could no longer perform the play. In many ways I had moved on and began to focus on transgender issues and less on anti-ex-gay activism. But I knew I was not done at all with talking and writing about these experiences. For one there is a large and growing group of ex-gay survivors, and we find that peer support is critical for working past much of the damage that comes from ex-gay ministry and reparative therapy (going to a properly trained and skilled therapist may also be essential for many of us.) In addition to connecting with others who have experienced the misery and the confusion around ex-gay treatment, including trying to figure out what to do with the good stuff we picked up along with all the poison, I knew I needed to explore my own experiences in writing. I tried back in 2003 before I wrote the play but decided to lay it down for a time. Last year while touring in the UK, I picked up the manuscript, judged it inferior and started over again.

As I have written this week about the structure of the Love in Action program and revisited my frame of mind during that time, I have begun a mourning process. I feel regret in a fresh new way and anger and sadness over what happened to me and what I allowed happen to me Yes, I can think about all the good things that emerged as a result, but I do not wish to invalidate the destruction those experiences caused me and others. I struggle to face it, to feel it, but I also have a courage and a determination to stare that pain in the face, to sit in it for a spell, to record it.

Lots of people in the media like to poke fun at the ex-gay experience. “These people think you can change, now look at the ridiculous methods they use…” with a cut-away to the infamous ex-gay therapist Richard Cohen smacking the snot out of some couch cushions while ranting about his mother. Ha ha, look at the foolish, deluded nut. Yeah, it is funny. Ridiculous. It is also terribly tragic. I guess that is what I am trying to capture in my writing these days–the silly and the sublime aspects of the ex-gay experience.

Queer and Queerer Ep. 12 – That’s So Fat! Body Image & Metrosexuality

Peterson and Zack are here to talk about that big bad issue that no one likes to be reminded of: body image. Body image issues affect all of us, but there are definitely some interesting and unique issues that arise in the LGB and T communities. In this week’s episode, we both talk about our own struggles with body image, we discuss different research that has come out about queer body issues, and we offer our own ideas about how we got where we are and where we’re going. We also invite listeners to share their own stories and struggles so we can build solidarity in our community.

Listen to Queer and Queerer Episode 12

Listen to this week’s episode:

// Here’s some more information about what we talked about this week:

» Vote for Zack (Ford) today to get him to Netroots Nation next month!

» David Mixner: On Being Fat

» Study shows gay men are thinner and lesbians are more obese.

» NYT: Gay? Whatever, Dude

» The End Of Heterosexuality (as We’ve Known It)

» Gay men better at recognizing faces: study

» TransForm New Hampshire

Weiner Mobile as seen by Zack

Queer and Queerer podcast Ep. 9 & 10 Fetishes and a whole lot more

Zack has never heard Peterson’s “From Soup to Nuts” expression, but it apparently defines our tenth episode well! After several mono-topical episodes, we dramatically over-compensate by limiting discussion on any topic to three minutes. We have a big pile of topics in a hat. Some were submitted by listeners, but we each contributed some of our without the other knowing what they are. We don’t get to them all, but we do address a total of 19 topics! Tune in to hear about Muslims, Catholics, Country Music, Goth, Glee, pansexuality, hats, and more! Special thanks to Gavin, Christopher, Peter, Scott, and everyone else who submitted topic ideas this week!

The Queer and Queerer Podcast!

Listen to episode 10

Here’s some more information about what we talked about this week:

» Study shows gay men are thinner and lesbians are more obese.

» Zack’s Recent Post: Why Celebrate a Conservative Gay Catholic?

» Documentary on coming out older: Latecomers.

» Towleroad: The Fate of I Love You Phillip Morris

» Learn more about Poe’s Law.

» Watch the Glee season finale on hulu!

» Just Fucking Google It.

Last week Zack and I recorded Episode 9 but I took to the Philadelphia Trans Health Conference before I could post it. So here it is!

Fetishes, Kinks, and Masturbation, Oh My! This week, Zack and Peterson delve into the topic of the sexually taboo! Why are kinks and fetishes taboo? What role does religion play in sexual repression and how can one’s faith intersect with the exploration of one’s sexuality? In what ways is the progress of the queer community impacted (for better or worse) by the kink, leather, and BDSM communities? The goal of today’s episode is not to be a tell-all about kink, but to open the door to having conversations about the taboo and showing support for the safe and consensual exploration of sexuality. (And it makes perfect sense to talk about sex when all the school buses are going by!)

Also, we need your help for next week’s episode. It’s going to be our “Topics out of a hat” episode, and we need you to suggest topics! They can be deep, shallow, serious, silly, political, social, or whatever. We’ll pick ten and talk for 3 minutes about each! Share them with us on Facebook or Twitter (@zackford and @p2son)!

The Queer and Queerer Podcast!

Listen to episode 9

Here’s some more information about what we talked about this week:

» Looking to connect with the kink community? Check out FetLife.com! (NSFW)

» Tyler McCormick wins the 32nd Annual International Mr. Leather.

» Philadelphia Trans-Health Conference (June 3-5)

» Extra reading: Greta Christina explores how Lady Gaga implements porn and kink into her artistry.

Queer and Queerer Ep. 8 – Bullying and the (Super) Power of Words

Here’s the impending scene: Peterson vs. hundreds of middle schoolers in an epic cage match! So, he turned to Zack to get his juices flowing about positive ways to get young people thinking about bullying and how to treat each other with more respect. In this roving episode, we talk about not only bullying, but also the challenge of invisibility, the power of words for good and for evil, Constance McMillen and her prom drama, “faggot,” “no homo,” and even Jason Mraz makes a cameo. You’ll also get to hear Peterson’s “Identity Monologue.” After you’ve listened, we hope you’ll share your own thoughts or experiences regarding bullying and any ideas you have for engaging young people in conversations about respect!

The Queer and Queerer Podcast!

Listen to this week’s episode:

// Here’s some more information about what we talked about this week:

» Learn more about the documentary Peterson reference, “Straightlaced.”

» Read Zack’s post about the word “faggot.”

» Jason Mraz offers his support of Harvey Milk Day and shares some of his own experiences of discrimination.

» Chocolate can help fight aging?

» Even though we didn’t talk about it on the podcast, a study came out this week suggesting that bullying is “good” for kids and that responding in turn somehow demonstrates social maturity. We’re skeptical, and the study definitely doesn’t mention anything about teen suicide, a very real consequence of bullying. For more info about LGBTQ suicide prevention, please check out The Trevor Project.

Failed Ex-Gays Speak Out. Rekers and Smid can learn something.

Sometimes it’s a good thing to be a failure, particularly when one tries to destroy their personality and sexuality (or assist others in destroying theirs.) The vast majority of people who have attempted to “de-gay” themselves through reparative therapy, straight camps and ex-gay ministries ultimately come out gay. Sadly many of these come out psychologically disheveled and need therapy to recover from the therapy. With stories flying around about George Rekers, a strong proponent of treatments to “cure gays” and legal actions to deny LGBT people rights (all the while using some of his anti-gay earnings to fund European vacations with a gay rent boy while asserting “I am NOT gay!) I thought it might be useful to hear from some folks who took part in some of these failed treatments.

Dr. Jallen Rix is an ex-gay survivor. He has already told his story through his widely read sex column and in the feature length documentary film Fish Can’t Fly. He now has a new book, Ex-Gay No Way! Survival and Recovery from Religious Abuse.

Jallen Rix, as a young Southern Baptist, joined an ex-gay ministry when he discovered his same-sex attractions. Although the ministry did not make him heterosexual, it did manage to destroy any sense of stability and self-esteem.
Ex-Gay No Way is Dr. Rix’s journey through the ex-gay world and what he did in the aftermath to reintegrate positive sexuality with healthy spirituality. Further, he demonstrates that the tactics used in these oppressive environments are many of the same damaging schemes used everywhere in power-abusive religious organizations today.

Jallen along with singer/songwriter Melissa Etheridge will appear on LA Talk Radio today May 14, 2010 from 6-8 PM PST. Check out the Tony Sweet program and learn more. Also check out this video of Jallen talking about his book.

Unlike ex-gay leaders like George Reker’s and others caught out there failing to live a life that they demanded of others, Micheal Bussee, one of the original founders of Exodus International, left the anti-gay ministry and chose to come out with his ministry partner (and then life partner Gary Cooper.) You may remember that Michael was one of three former Exodus officials who issued a public apology in 2007. This apology can serve as a model for people like John Smid, the former director of Love in Action, who has struggled to come up with a clear statement that reveals why he is apologizing and the steps he is taking to undo the damage.

In Michael’s personal apology he issued the same day as the group apology, he talks about the early work of offering “alternatives” to gays, and how it did not work, and more importantly it caused great harm.

I need to say that some had a positive, life-changing experience attending our Bible studies and support groups. They experienced God’s love and the welcoming fellowship of others who knew the struggle. There were some real “changes”—but not one of the hundreds of people we counseled became straight.

Instead, many of our clients began to fall apart – sinking deeper into patterns of guilt, anxiety and self-loathing. Why weren’t they “changing”? The answers from church leaders made the pain even worse: “You might not be a real Christian.” “You don’t have enough faith.” “You aren’t praying and reading the Bible enough.” “Maybe you have a demon.” The message always seemed to be: “You’re not enough. You’re not trying hard enough. You don’t have enough faith.”

Some simply dropped out and were never heard from again. I think they were the lucky ones. Others became very self-destructive. One young man got drunk and deliberately drove his car into a tree. Another (a fellow leader of the ex-gay movement) told me that he had left EXODUS and was now going to straight bars – looking for someone to beat him up. He said the beatings made him feel less guilty – atoning for his sin. One of my most dedicated clients, Mark, took a razor blade to his genitals, slashed himself repeatedly, and then poured drain-cleaner on the wounds—because after months of celibacy he had a “fall.”

In the midst of all of this, my own faith in the EXODUS movement was crumbling. No one was really becoming “ex-gay.” Who were we fooling? As one current EXODUS leader admitted, we were just “Christians with homosexual tendencies who would rather not have those tendencies.” By calling ourselves “ex-gay” we were lying to ourselves and to others. We were hurting people.

Over at the blog Box Turtle Bulletin, ex-gay survivor (in a very sexy This American Life voice) Daniel Gonzales has begun to post a series of short videos where Michael talks about his role in Exodus, his regrets and the terrible things that happened in a ministry that set out to help the struggling homosexual.

In this video Michael talks about the the inherent harm that comes from ex-gay treatment and comments on John Smid’s “apology.” Bussee makes it clear that:

It’s the message that’s destructive, it’s the overall message.

As that message sinks in to your sense of self that you’re damaged, you’re broken, you’re in need of repair… that’s the damage.

There are people that don’t become aware of that damage until years later.

(Transcript here)
[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5WSMmdPiDE&hl=en_US&fs=1&]

In this video Michael talks about what happens after people LEAVE ex-gay treatment and reveals how they never offered any kind of after-care or even checked in to see how people where doing. (Read full transcript here.)
[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5q8NX2ZhIE&hl=en_US&fs=1&]

And in this video Michael Bussee, who has known LOTS of ex-gays in his life reveals that NO ONE including the leaders actually changed in spite of what they publicly said. We Were All Still Struggling Silently As We Promised Change (Transcript here)
[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xs-5eBMTcj4&hl=en_US&fs=1&]

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Tag: lesbian

For LGBTIQ folks & Allies: What film(s) has been helpful to you in coming out/becoming an ally.